Thursday, December 31, 2009

Sometimes the hard things turn out to be easy

As we begin a new year we often find ourselves looking back over the past year as well as thinking of how 2010 will be for us. I find myself in the very fortunate position of being able to talk to many entrepreneurs on a weekly basis and many times it is their positive unstoppable attitude that encourages me to keep going and face some of the hard things that life puts in our way. I had two such conversations the other day and both wound up surprisingly the same way. For many of us 2009 was a year of taking hits, assessing the damage and creating plans to repair the damage. 2010 not only will be a good year but it has to be a good year! 2010 will be, it must be, a year for building.

Although 2010 is a year we must build, we actually have three options; we can continue to take hits and put out fires blaming the economy, greed, the weather, whatever, for our continuing struggle; we can go back to what we were doing back before we decided to spread our entrepreneurial wings, reliving the reasons we wanted out or we can determine that 2009 is over, we learned some lessons but now it is time to move forward. For most of us there is only one choice, in 2010 we must build.

Building our businesses will require an honest look at what we are doing and accessing just how effective those things are. Processes that worked like a charm a year or two ago may no longer work today. Building our businesses now also requires a new focus on the bottom line. In years where revenue was easily generated we could afford to take our eye off of expenses. We no longer have that luxury and controlling our expenses is just as important as generating additional income.

Building in 2010 is not just about business it is also about building or rebuilding relationships. Taking the hits that many of us took in 2009 can put serious stress on our relationships. Relationships with our family, friends and even business associates suffer as we lose trust in each other. It is a natural instinct when things go wrong to look around in order to find fault and lay blame. 2010 must also be a year to build relationships. Without the support of those that truly love us and want the best for us building a business is difficult and pretty much pointless.

Building sometimes seems to be hard and if we look at it as a whole it might even seem impossible, but if we break it down into steps it begins to look possible. As we execute those steps we will look back and say “Why was I dreading doing that? That was easy”. Sometimes the hardest part about doing something is deciding to do it and then taking the first step.

I recently had an experience with doing something I thought would be hard but it turned out to be easy. I learned to be a fire eater. That’s right I ate fire! I went to an event where I knew at some point we would be given the chance to eat fire. The group leader told us that after lunch he would teach us how to eat fire. I thought “good there will be some detailed instruction, practice drills and plenty of discussion of technique.” I was wrong. The instruction took about 30 seconds and the practice took another 30 seconds. It turns out there are only four steps to eating fire. (I would give you the four steps but I could not live with myself if you set your living room on fire) Before the fire eating, Marshal Sylver, our instructor, asked us if we thought it would be hard to eat fire. We all answered yes. Afterwards, he asked how many of us now found out how easy it was to eat fire. Again we all answered yes. Then came the big question how many things stand in our way because we think that they are too hard to do when if we actually did them we would find out that it was easy. I ask you the same question in choosing to build in 2010.
See my FIRE EATING VIDEO>>

Wednesday, October 28, 2009

Some Call It Greed

We have seen a change in our nation’s attitude toward wealth and those who try to achieve it. It seems to have started a year or so ago and began to gain speed immediately following the collapse of the economy. Things such as building businesses and maintaining portfolios are now consider greedy selfish endeavors “How dare he try to make money now? Can’t he see that there are people suffering?” For some reason people see the suffering but not the cause, the collapse of wealth. It was just a few short years ago when wealth and achievement were celebrated.

The focus has changed from wants to needs. How often do we hear, “does he really need that trip, airplane, luxury car etc.?” Need is understandable in a person’s own life when the current circumstances cause personal cut backs. However need should not be a factor when looking at others. Want is an acceptable reason for having something. I went to an expensive restaurant not because I needed to but because I wanted to and there is nothing wrong with that. I can still remember hearing the collect gasp that was uttered when it was announced that Michel Jackson’s elaborate casket cost more than $25,000.

In times like these, I remember the teachings of one of my many mentors. “It is indeed not selfish or greedy to create businesses, focus on achieving your goals or building wealth. It is in fact selfish and greedy not to do so. If you have been given the intellect, the strength and the courage to create businesses, achieve great things and make money and you do not do it, then you are selfish. The businesses you did not create will not provide the goods and services the public wants. The non-existent business will also not provide jobs for your local community. The world will not benefit or be encouraged by the things you did not achieve. The wealth you did not create did not benefit people in need around the world. Not many great chartable works are funded by the impoverished.

Not only is it selfish and greedy to not do all you are capable of doing to build your wealth, but it is also unpatriotic. America is the country credited with the phrase “making money”. Before America came into existence money was not made, it was inherited or otherwise transferred. Wealth creation is an American born idea. It goes hand and hand with freedom and liberty.

Another important concept I have learned from my mentors is that wealthy people support charities. It is important to be part of the solution and many worthwhile causes allow us to do just that. Now it is an especially important time to find a cause and support it. With the government created (it is my blog so I will tell it like it is) economic crisis we are now in charitable giving is down. The lack of private sector support for many worthy causes is giving the government another excuse for interfering more in our daily lives.

Some of you may be saying that you will start giving once you have become wealthy. Please let me share another concept with you. In order to achieve or create anything great you should follow these three principles. First, make your desire known. Second, do everything you know to do to accomplish it. Third, accept it is being done. The first two are easy to understand but what does accept it as being done mean? It simply means being ready to accept the fact that you actually have achieved your goal. One of the ways to do this is to begin to act as if you have already achieved it. In other words if want to be wealthy then act as the wealthy act and start to give. Pick a cause that you can get behind and support it.

Wednesday, September 16, 2009

Inside The Mind Of A Racist

Why does Jimmy Carter think that Joe Wilson and everyone else opposed to Obama’s policies are racist. Some people say that they are just trying to take the focus off of the policy. Some think it is a way to shut off conversation. Once you accuse some of racism the conversation is pretty much over.

While these reasons may be true for some Racers I don’t believe it is true for Jimmy Carter and many other Racers. For Jimmy I believe he honestly believes Rep. Wilson and the rest are racists. It is well know that Jimmy is a racist. His racist world view helps form his opinions. For example Jimmy’s racist hatred of Jews leads to his unrelenting support for Hamas. So the reason Jimmy thinks people are opposed to Obama’s policies are because they are racist, is because that is how he would see things. He assumes that because he sees the world through racist eyes that everyone else does too. Well Mr lust in my heart the world is not made up of a bunch of racist like you and the people you surround yourself with.

In September 2009 Joe Wilson, a white man, called Obama, a black man, a liar. Jimmy says the reason this happens, a white person calls a black person a liar, is that the white person is a racist. In April 2008 Jimmy, a white man, called Condoleezza Rice, a black woman, a liar. In Jimmy’s mind why did he do that???????

Thursday, August 27, 2009

I Was Wrong!!

Anybody who knows me knows that I am not a liberal. I am one who clearly stood on the side of the CIA integrators in the torture controversy. These heroes were doing what was necessary to protect our nation after the attacks on 9/11. I was outraged to learn of the justice department’s investigation of the CIA. I thought that Obama was on the verge of treason for releasing documents on our enhanced interrogation methods, allowing terrorist to learn to withstand them. I believed that idea of closing GITMO was ridiculous and misguided.

It is with great humility that I now admit I was wrong. I had no idea until now how far over the line the thugs at the CIA had gone. At some point you need to ask yourself is this nation worth saving if it becomes unrecognizable in the process. Are we not a nation built on justice and mercy?

What brought me to this revelation? It wasn’t the reports of mock executions or the naked human pyramids at Abu Ghraib. It was not even the sleep deprivation or the water boarding. What finally changed my mind is what I saw in a newly released video. In the video it shows CIA operatives dressed in red using the most inhuman forms of torture possible. To make matters worse (as if that were possible) the video shows clearly the torture was being perpetrated on an innocent little old lady! As anybody can see and hear for themselves this women had no idea why she was even there! On top of all of that the reason for the torture was not only to obtain information but also to force her to convert.

I am just relieved the 8 long years of the dark ages in America are over. I just hope this renaissance is not too late. I know some of you are disappointed and angry with me for my change. All I can say is please watch this video, it is short, and tell me if it does not change your mind as well. Be prepared this video is shocking. Watch Video Now

Tuesday, August 25, 2009

Finally Someone Has the Answer and All He Gets Is A Boycott

I have always liked Whole Foods, although I have only been an occasional shopper, but after the Op Ed article, Whole Foods CEO John Mackey, published in the WSJ I will make Whole Foods my primary store. He exactly nailed the solution for healthcare in our country. His thoughts are not just a mere theory but they have been employed with great success at his company.

A misguided group of, well I won’t write what I am thinking, let’s just simply say socialist and their blind followers started a group on Facebook to boycott Whole Foods. Why, because Mackey had the nerve to suggest an alternative to the healthcare plan of our Dear Leader. I seem to remember that on several occasions our Dear Leader said he was willing to listen to anybody’s suggestions on how to “fix” our healthcare system. I guess that to the socialist members of the Facebook group this does not include the ideas from someone who has actually been successful at “fixing” healthcare. The reaction to Mackey’s Op Ed shows us that the goal of the left is not to solve the problems with our current healthcare system as they proclaim it to be. Their goal is in reality to continue increasing the government’s role in all of our lives.

What are the horribly dangerous ideas that Mackey suggested justify the boycott and the personal attacks? You can read the Op Ed for yourself but in summary here they are right out of his article

• Remove the legal obstacles that slow the creation of high-deductible health insurance plans and health savings accounts (HSAs)
•  Equalize the tax laws so that that employer-provided health insurance and individually owned health insurance have the same tax benefits
• Repeal all state laws which prevent insurance companies from competing across state lines
• Repeal government mandates regarding what insurance companies must cover
• Enact tort reform to end the ruinous lawsuits that force doctors to pay insurance costs of hundreds of thousands of dollars per year
• Make costs transparent so that consumers understand what health-care treatments cost
• Enact Medicare reform
• Finally, revise tax forms to make it easier for individuals to make a voluntary, tax-deductible donation to help the millions of people who have no insurance and aren’t covered by Medicare, Medicaid or the State Children’s Health Insurance Program

I have had many people say to me that you are quick to criticize Obama’s plan, but what are your suggestions. Well the points listed above are them; by and large Mackey nailed it. He was brave enough and patriotic enough to offer positive input on this volatile subject and he has been rewarded with calls for his resignation from the company he co-founded. Mackey was foolish enough to believe that Obama and his supporters really wanted to solve the problem and he tried to help.

Please support Mackey and Whole Foods, shop at their stores, e-mail your support and if you are on Facebook become a fan of Whole Foods. If you want to let one of the founders of the boycott know what you think e-mail him at markerosenthal@gmail.com Please be respectful he was brave enough to list his e-mail address.

Monday, August 17, 2009

Paid Healthcare Activist. Guess what side they are on.

You just are not going to believe this, or unfortunately maybe you will. For weeks now we have been hearing from the President and his followers that the opposition to Obama-care is not a grass roots effort. They call it Astroturf. They say that the angry mobs showing up at town hall meetings are paid operatives. Maybe they think that because that is exactly what they are doing!!!!

I took a couple of minutes and found these job postings on craigslist.org.

This one is posted in the SF Bay area on Aug 14 under the category nonprofit sector
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/scz/npo/1323127000.html


This one is posted in Los Angeles on Aug 12 under the category nonprofit sector
http://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/npo/1320138750.html

Sometimes the links from craigslist.org don’t last in that case go to craiglist.org, pick your favorite liberal city and search the jobs in the nonprofit sector. You will notice not only are they hiring people to fight for Obama-care but they are also hiring the “grass roots concerned citizens” to fight for Cap and Trade. By the way I searched in some of the conservative cities and found no ads from the right.

Yet again we find that when liberals point their finger and accuse they are looking in the mirror.

Saturday, August 15, 2009

The Day We Will Be Told How Much We Can Earn

August 14th is a date that may become a historically significant date. Not for the obvious reason, it was my birthday but it was the deadline for companies to submit compensation information to the Pay Czar. Since June, when he was appointed, Pay Czar, Wesley Mouch, oops I mean Kenneth Feinberg, has been hard at work interviewing the several companies whose executive pay comes under his authority.

My question is where did Mouch’s, oh I mean Feinberg’s, authority come from? I know he was appointed by the President and I suppose the President can appoint whoever he would like to advise him. But Mouch, ah Fienberg, is making rules not advising. At least cabinet members must have the Senates consent before they take office. In a letter to the Treasury Secretary, Dave Mitchum, oh I mean Timothy Geithner, Nancy Pelosi and Barney Frank said "Congress and taxpayers alike are rightly alarmed that companies would enrich their executives while deferring repayment of the federal financial assistance that helped them avoid financial catastrophe". So I guess Mouch, I mean Feinberg, has the authority to do what ever he wants since the Constitution specifically states that if the Speaker of the House and Barney Frank (yes the founding fathers mentioned Barney by name) write a letter citing the avoidance of a financial catastrophe any Presidential appointee shall have the authority to make any rule the appointee deems necessary, as long as the rule has no effect on any member of Congress. What you don’t think that clause is in the constitution? You want me to show it to you? How dare you. You are just another Astroturf mob member, a wing nut birther and someone who I will report to flag@whitehouse.gov if you don’t watch it. Now if we can move on to something more productive.

For now Mouch er Fienberg (I just don’t know why I keep getting these names confused) has the authority to set the compensation for executives of the companies that have not yet paid the government back for the TARP money they were loaned. I guess that I am ok with that because there should be some penalty for taking government money but what may happen next is concerning to me. The TARP companies will not be allowed to pay their people at the market rate while the non-TRAP companies can. Naturally the best and the brightest will leave the TARP companies and head to the non-tarp companies. With inferior leadership the TARP companies will not be able to compete causing them to lose even more money making them even less likely to pay back the government and possibly require even more government loans. This will infuriate Congress who will demand the CEOs appear before them to explain why things are going so poorly. The CEOs will blame it on the brain drain caused by their uncompetitive compensation structure. Congress will then turn to Mouch Fienberg whatever his name is and demand he level the playing field and that is when the Pay Czar will tell all of us how much we can be paid.

Thursday, August 13, 2009

Hang Up and Govern


They say that driving while texting or using your cell phone is just as dangerous as drunk driving. So how much more dangerous is it to govern while using a cell phone? The driver only effects the lives of the people in their car and the people on the road around them but elected officials effect the lives of everyone in our nation for generations.

At her town hall meeting Rep Sheila Jackson Lee took a cell phone call while Tracy Miller, a cancer survivor, was asking her a question. Still think the shouting at these meetings is unwarranted? Latter Representative Lee explained that she was calling into a health care help desk to get an answer to another constituent’s question. The problem with that explanation is that according to Miller, she was the second person to ask a question. Apparently Rep Lee was stumped after the first question! The phone call in reality again according to Miller was more than likely from Lee’s staff letting her know what VIPs were attending so she could acknowledge them.

Also on the town hall front and also in Texas Rep Green is seeking legislation to require town hall attendees show photo ID before being allowed into the meeting. The purpose of the ID is to insure that the attendee is from the Members’ district. The problem with Rep Green’s position is that he voted and campaigned against a requirement for voters to show an ID before voting. Rep Green must believe that town hall “fraud” is far more dangerous than voter fraud. Or perhaps he was just distracted by his cell phone.

Wednesday, August 12, 2009

Happy Cost of Government Day

Happy cost of government day!! Up until today all the money you, the average American, has earned this year covers your share of the cost to operate the government (federal, state and local) for the year. Many of you remember that this year’s Tax Freedom Day was April 13th. What accounts for this difference? The deficit! The government spends almost 75% of the income all Americans earn in one year. That leaves 25% to be spent elsewhere and some wonder why the economy is where it is. Most of our elected officials think that government needs to spend even more to fix the economy.

Isn’t it time to ask if we really need this much government?
Isn’t it time to cut the spending?
Isn’t it time for some reason?

Wednesday, August 5, 2009

So now do you still think voting Libertarian is throwing away your vote?

On Friday July 30th, before leaving Washington for their summer recess the House of Representatives passed a bill to clamp limits on Wall Street bonuses. Oh by the way this limit on bonuses is not just for companies that have taken bailouts, it is across the board. You see the government is much better at deciding how much an employer should pay an employee than letting the employer and employee agree on compensation beween themselves. Rep Melvin Watt, D-N.C clearly believes in that philosophy this is what he said about the bill, “This is not the government taking over the corporate sector; It is a statement by the American people that it is time for us to straighten up the ship."

This is yet another intrusion into not only into private business but into our private lives. That is the Democrats view but what about our beloved Republicans, the guardians of free enterprise and limited government, what are they doing? Here was how AP put it: “Aware of voter outrage about the bonuses, Republicans were reluctant in Friday's debate to push back”.

Looks to me like voting Republican is just throwing my vote away! They won’t even take a stand on something as basic as letting a company decide how much it will pay its employees. This is not the only issue affecting our lives the Republicans have remained silent on or offered only half hearted rebuttal on. As the saying goes with friends like that who needs enemies.

It is time to stop looking at the letter (R, D, L) behind the candidate’s name and assuming we know what they stand for. It is becoming more and more apparent that we cannot assume R stands for conservative or even for that matter conservative stands for less government. We do have a chose and for me it has been made clear that voting Libertarian is a viable option, especially in the mid-term elections.

Monday, July 27, 2009

What Would Walt Do?

Last night I watched the movie “Grand Torino”. I saw it back in February and it was one of those movies that had such a strong effect on me that I had to get it as soon as the video came out. At the time I wrote a short post about it and after watching the movie again I decided to re-post the article here.

Those of you who’ve see the movie “Grand Torino” will recognize the name Walt Kowalski as the character played by Clint Eastwood. For those of you who have not seen the movie (the language in the movie is tough but the story and the message is incredible) I do not want to give it away but Walt is a retired Ford assembly line worker and a Korean War veteran who still lives in the Detroit area house where he raised his two kids. Needless to say his neighborhood has gone through a few changes and has become a crime ridden hopeless place. Walt is a hold out from a past generation, a generation that was by and large self sufficient. He has no need or use for help from anyone. In one scene after Walt breaks up a gang fight with a shot gun, he is asked “why didn’t you just call the police?” Walt’s reply was something like “in Korea when the enemy attacked our position we could not just call the police”. There are few other great messages in the story other than the self reliance one but a message of self reliance really stands out these days.

This was brought home to me when right after seeing the movie Diana and I saw a man standing at the entrance to a grocery store holding a sign saying “I have lost everything but faith”. As we drove by, I asked Diana what would Walt have done if he lost everything? Diana said that she thought that Walt would have worked to get it all back and certainly not wait for someone else to help him. My thought was that by just sitting there, holding a sign and waiting for someone else to do something to help shows that the man had lost faith, faith in himself. It troubles me that with all the bailouts and stimulus packages our government is encouraging all of us to exchange our faith in ourselves for an unwarranted faith in the government. The powers that be want to change Americans from self reliance to government dependence.

Don’t take what I am saying to mean that we should not be concerned with our neighbors or be greedy and selfish; Americans have never been that way. Helping our friends and neighbors has always been our, we the peoples, job not that of the government. When I was a kid I remember when “I‘m here from the government and I’m here to help” was the punch line to a joke not a way of life. Remember the Pilgrims did not come to America to have a government take care of them.

Saturday, July 25, 2009

Obama Will Pay For Healthcare on the Backs or Should I Say the Graves of Seniors

According to the administration Obama’s healthcare plan is essential to our economic recovery. We have been told that rising healthcare costs will bankrupt small businesses and are the driving force behind the government’s sky rocketing deficit. While it is certainly arguable whether or not all of this is true, everybody agrees that lowering the cost of healthcare is a worthy goal. The issue is how should it be done. Obama tells us that we could reduce the cost and cover more people if the government becomes more involved. I am sorry but increased government involvement and lower costs just do not go together but then again some do call Obama the Messiah.

The reality is the only way a government controlled healthcare program can reduce costs is to reduce services and this is exactly what the President is suggesting. When asked how will he pay for his plan he says two thirds of the cost will come from cutting out waste. I believe that the President considers treating seniors as waste. I know that sounds extreme but consider this, in the House bill HR3200 there is a provision that will require everyone who is 65 years old or older to meet with a practitioner at least every 5 years to discuss end of life issues. You can read this provision for yourself it is in section 1233 of the bill.

Some will say that I am reading too much into section 1233. They say it is a good idea it merely explains the options and services available to people as they near the end of their life expectancy. Interesting but I believe one of the purposes of those meeting is to discuss a senior’s “duty to die”. I know this sounds all too much like Logan’s Run but it is the way the administration is thinking. Before you say Warren you have gone way too far this time did you know that at a town hall meeting Obama actually suggested that because of someone’s age it may have been better if she would have just taken a pain pill rather than get a pacemaker! No this is not a rumor or taken out of context watch it for yourself.

Most of us don’t read The Journal of The American Medical Association so thanks to Liberty’s Army for finding a June 18th article written by Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel. In case that names sounds familiar Ezekiel is the brother of the President’s chief of staff, Rahm Emanuel, he is also a health policy advisor in the Office of Management and Budget for the Obama administration. In his article he writes. Savings will require changing how doctors think about their patients: Doctors take the Hippocratic Oath too seriously, “as an imperative to do everything for the patient regardless of the cost or effects on others”

Obama is taking a queue from the lyrics of a song by The Who
for his healthcare plan “ I hope I die before I get old”. Well I hope the American people will take a queue from the lyrics of another Who song “ We won’t be fooled again”.

Thursday, July 23, 2009

Obama calls doctors a bunch money grubbing parasites

I listened to the President's talk about healthcare July 22. The thing that I remember most is that he basically called doctors a bunch of money grubbing parasites that put money ahead of their patients needs. He said, “You come in and you've got a bad sore throat, or your child has a bad sore throat, or has repeated sore throats, the doctor may look at the reimbursement system and say to himself, you know what? I make a lot more money if I take this kid's tonsils out." He blames it on the system?? Nonsense and even if it was the system his plan will not change this, unless he is going to compensate the doctor the same regardless of whether the doctor does a tonsillectomy or gives him a throat lozenge. He must apologize to all doctors immediately!!!!

Wednesday, July 22, 2009

History Shows Us the Truth About Obama’s Healthcare Plan

Obama’s healthcare plan is the biggest most sweeping government program since social security. The President has been out trying to win over support for this program. He has been telling us how essential it is to our economy and making many promises as to what it will do for us. Obama has made five promises for his healthcare plan:
1. Participation is voluntary
2. It will cost less
3. It Will cover everybody
4. You can keep your current doctor
5. It will not add to the deficit

All this may sound well and good but these are merely promises. Obama has often been compared to FDR so let’s see what history can teach us about FDR’s big new program. When Franklin Roosevelt introduced his proposal for a new program, Social Security, he promised five things:
1. Participation would be completely voluntary
2. Participants would only pay 1% of the first $1,400 of their income.
3. The money that participants elected to contribute would be tax deductible
4. The money put into the social security program would only be used to pay social security benefits. The money would not be used to pay for any other government programs
5. Social security benefit payments would not be taxable income.

I don’t need to tell you as you all ready know not a single promise was kept and the future solvency of the Social Security program is very much in doubt. Oh you say this time it is different the Democrats are in charge and they would never let anything happen to our healthcare plan. Every one of the social security promises were broken by the Democrats. Oh but how can this be I thought the Republicans were the ones taking away social security? And there you see the real reason Obama and his party are pushing so hard for the healthcare plan. It will create an even larger dependent class that they can lie to and scare them into keeping them in power.

Sunday, June 28, 2009

Health Insurance

I think the issue with health insurance is that it is not really insurance or at least it is not used as insurance. What health “insurance” has evolved into is pre-paid medical. Insurance is supposed to be used for the unexpected, the unforeseen incident that we can do little to protect ourselves from. Fire insurance in case our home burns down. We have theft insurance in case we are burglarized. We buy auto insurance in case of an accident. If we treated auto insurance as we treat health insurance it would pay for our gas, oil changes and even routine repairs. I believe that many of the problems we have today with our health care system can be solved if we went back to a true insurance model. Use our health insurance only for major medical expenses. We should pay for our regular doctor visits, minor illnesses and yes even prescriptions out of our own pockets. But wait you say you cannot afford that! I think that we cannot afford not to. The only way to bring down the cost of health services while maintaining quality is to have the people using the services pay for the services directly. Let’s say that a routine doctor visit cost $350. I have no idea how much it actually costs and I would bet that most you don’t either. Many of us would rightly say that we cannot afford to go to the doctor and we would no longer go. This is where the miracle happens; doctors’ not wanting to go out of business find away to reduce the $350 office visit to $150 or want ever it takes to get patients back in the door. Medical costs are high because they can be. If the government takes over the payment of medical expenses from insurance companies we have not fixed the problem only masked the symptom. Artificial price controls will only lead to shortages and lower quality. This has been true ever time price controls have been used in every industry I have no reason to believe that this time will be the exception